Tuesday, 17 April 2012

Separating young male and female chickens

Raising our chickens from eggs has been a long, interesting, wonderful and sometimes devastating experience. I want to share what I've learned.



Along the way, we've learned a lot, much of which I have not been able to learn from books or from anywhere on the internet that I could find.

Which is why I want to share with you what I've learned about when to separate males and females that we've raised from eggs, and discuss the problems we've had along the way.

We incubated about 40-50 eggs in the one incubation set. Of those, we ended up with 21 chickens. The best hatch rate we had was from our own, half-barnevelder eggs (barnevelder rooster, mixed flock hens). The worst we had was from one breeder who sold us a dozen fertile eggs through TradeMe, of which four hatched and three were deformed and soon died.

Here we are, 10-11 weeks on, and we have 9 female hens and five males. The last few weeks have not been good. We started to lose chickens about 2-3 weeks ago, and couldn't figure out why.

They were attacking one another. We'd go in to check their food and water, and find a chicken dead, its insides ripped out, and the others eating what was left of the carcass. It wasn't pretty. We'd remove the dead bird immediately, then a few days later find another.

It was only late last week that we realised the birds that were dying were all - with one exception - male birds.

So with five birds down, we were faced with a decision: did we kill the remaining males (which were destined for the freezer anyway) immediately, in order to prevent further suffering, or did we try separating out the males from the females, in the hopes that the problems were caused by a dominance issue between the males over the females?

We have decided on the latter, and separated the males from the females immediately into the cleared-out tomato house. It wasn't ideal, and isn't great digs for them, but we decided to see how they go, and if we have another attack, and even one dead bird, we'll kill the remaining males and consider it over.

I'd rather they died humanely than suffered at the beaks and claws of their fellows, and died by being ripped to pieces.

So from our original incubation we now have nine females (or what appear to be females - they certainly appear female, but you never can be 100% certain this early) and five definite males. We're building the chicken tractors as fast as we can, and should have proper accommodation for them pretty soon.

So it has been a rough learning curve. It's clear now that, with the next incubation, males and females really need separation from each other at about six weeks - or as soon as you can determine gender. Any later and you risk the chickens attacking one another.

We want to keep the males a while longer, as they're putting weight on nicely, and the bigger they are, the better they'll be for the table. But they'll probably be killed in the next week or two, and in the freezer by Anzac Day (April 25th).

So - a short assessment of what I've learned:

  • Incubating chickens is definitely worthwhile. It is easy to do, and a great experience for kids and for adults :)

  • You have to be willing to kill chicks / hens that are dying or injured.

  • The best eggs to use are your own, rather than purchased fertile eggs from breeders. It is cheaper and more efficient to purchase a rooster than to get fertile eggs from elsewhere.

  • An easy baby chick brooder (for the first 1-2 weeks) can be made from a heat lamp and a large plastic crate, with paper towel for lining. You'll also need a small food dispenser and a special chick waterer.

  • Chicks need special baby chicken food, called crumble. You can buy this in large bags from farm supply stores. They'll move on to adult food at about 5-8 weeks of age.

  • Chicks grow very quickly, and will soon need larger digs. They'll still need a heat lamp until fully feathered (about 6-8 weeks) and food and water dispensers. You'll need to check food and water daily - water in particular gets dirtied quickly. Their coop will need to be vermin (mouse and rat) proof and tight enough that tiny chicks cannot escape or get stuck anywhere.

  • Males and females will need to be separated from each other, or males slaughtered, at about 6-7 weeks of age. No later than 8 weeks of age, or males will start killing each other as they attempt to dominate the flock. Injured chickens will be attacked by others. Deaths can happen quickly - in one instance, we checked our chickens, and they were fine, then checked again 1 hour later and one was dead.

  • Breeds with an obvious difference between males and females are advantageous, as you can sex them early, and remove / separate males. Barnevelders are easy to pick the males in - the males are quite different from the females at an early age.

  • Chickens start laying at between 16 and 22 weeks of age. Factor this into the expense of raising them.


I hope this is useful - it's based on my experience. I'm enjoying raising my chicks, despite the pitfalls, and can't wait to raise the next incubation in Springtime.


Have a lovely day!
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7 comments:

Susan Moore said...

I really appreciate your posts about what you have learned about keeping and raising chickens. I am a complete beginner at this (currently have only 4 Barnevelder chickens over here in Tasmania, but with plans to grow) and you're right, many of the basic questions I have are not answered in books or most online resources. I have learnt some useful things from your blog, thank you.

farmer_liz said...

Great summary. We had the same problem with roosters fighting. We found that if they are in a small pen together they didn't fight, but as soon as we let them out to free range they would fight. So now they just stay locked up together in a small-ish cage until they are big enough to eat. They can be so cruel to each other! Good to see how much you've learnt, looking forward to seeing your tractors!

Leanne said...

Hi Susan - Yeah, there just isn't enough useful information on the net, and what I found seemed to be (a lot of it) just the same stuff recycled over and over from the same books, with very little of it from people who have actually done it and experienced issues.

Which is why it is important to share the problems and pitfalls when they happen. Too many blogs skim over the nasty stuff (like chickens killing each other) and everything always seems sunny and positive, with no downside.

Our chooks are all about 10-11 weeks now and a good size - certainly old / big enough to slaughter for the freezer if need be. So if the males have any further problems, we'd rather be humane and do that. Animals should never needlessly suffer - it's our job as caretakers to treat them well.

Another thing I did learn from a website (I don't know if it is true or not) is that incubators set to the lower end of the temperature range for hatching tend to hatch fewer males. This might be useful info to file away for you if you're incubating for layers, rather than meat stock, like we are.

Good luck with your chickens, and keep in touch if you have any questions, or learn anything you can teach me! :)

Leanne said...

Hi Farmer Liz - Yeah, we've got the roosters in a propagation shed now, about 12ft circular, and they seem to be fine. It's not ideal, but it will do for now.

I just wish I'd known they'd fight. We could have saved lives with that knowledge. *sigh*

The first tractor is going well. The dimensions are 3m long by 1.5 wide by 85 cm high, with a full flap at the run end, and a half flap at the shelter end.

Cost-wise, our materials have worked out to just under $200NZ (about $160 Aussie / $165 USD - that's including all wood, mesh, hinges and screws, and plastic boxes for nesting / laying. So pretty cheap.

That will make a tractor 4.5 metres in area, easily big enough for 10 hens (or in our case, 8 hens and 1 rooster).

We'll be making a smaller version after this one, which will be 2.5 m long x 1.5 metres, designed for suburban families who want smaller flocks.

We'll put full plans and instructions (with pictures of both) up on this site, for free download. They're designed for complete novices at building (like me) to be able to build with just hand tools and a drill.

infoaddict said...

I can't recommend online forums enough for finding out information, as they tend to self-correct pretty quickly even if completely wrong information is supplied, and the good ones are very up-to-date. The one I link to regularly - forum.backyardpoultry.com - is Australian-based and has a large NZ contingent, with lots of sensible, non-patronising advice.

I must admit I've never experienced chicks killing eachother at such a young age, or heard of it in my friends who breed large numbers of chicks. I know it can occur in gamefowl breeds, but I've never seen it in my softfeather birds.

I get deaths and yes, if I don't grab them quickly enough the live birds will cannibalise the dead body to some extent, but the deaths are always the ones I had mentally tagged as more susceptible to illness/disease anyway.

I raise my chicks in seriously large spaces - currently they're cleaning up the orchard for me - which helps reduce my deaths to coccidiosis. However, friends who raise chicks in less enormous spaces haven't reported aggression against roosters in their chicks.

When the cockerels get mature then I need to separate them out from the girls because of their over-enthusiastic hormonal rush - I have had some deaths when chicks can't get away. All-male pens are surprisingly calm and well-behaved, and makes it easy to feed them up for dinner purposes, as long as they're utterly unaware of the existence of female chooks in their immediate vicinity. The first sight of girl-tail sends them into a bit of a frenzy, however. But my bachelor pen of mixed-breed cockerels had boys up to 6 months of age, and no deaths or serious aggression in all that time. (Up until the point I turned them into dinners, anyway ... ).

You may wish to look at your feed for the chicks - there are actually three stages of chicken growth, and three commercially-available sets of feed to cater for them. There's hatching-to-first feathers, which is hatching to about 7-8 weeks, and for which a crumble-based feed is supplied. Then there's teenage-to-POL, which is 8-16 weeks, for which you get get crumbles, micropellets, or grain-based mixes with micropellets.

After that, they're adults, and can go onto a full adult feed, although I know many people who keep their birds on the pullet grower crumbles until the first egg. This first egg can be anywhere from 16 weeks to 30 weeks, depending on the breed of the chook, the weather, and the time of year when they mature.

Note that the chick grower and pullet crumble (different suppliers have different names for these two feeds) often contain medication against coccidiosis, which is endemic in poultry flocks and can kill chicks very quickly. Both are higher-protein feeds, to help chicks form feathers and muscle, and don't contain shellgrit as too much extra calcium in the early stages can cause bone issues later in life.

Because of my local health issues, I actually supplement my chickfeed with a game bird finisher, which is 20% protein - much higher than normal chick food - and the results have been impressive. Considerably fewer random deaths, much healthier adults, much less aggression between the chicks, and almost zero cannibalisation of those few deaths. And lovely solid chunky roosters, too :). It's worth a try if you're seeing excessive cannibalism in your chicks.

I use unmedicated feed and instead medicate for cocci in the water at my own intervals; this has much better results in my large-range situation than using medicated feeds.

infoaddict said...

A comment about incubator temperature: “Another thing I did learn from a website (I don't know if it is true or not) is that incubators set to the lower end of the temperature range for hatching tend to hatch fewer males. This might be useful info to file away for you if you're incubating for layers, rather than meat stock, like we are. “

This is unfortunately incorrect. Gender of chicks is set at point of conception and doesn’t change through the subsequent three weeks. Temperature of incubation affects some reptiles, but has absolutely no effect on chicks, unfortunately. Otherwise, big poultry businesses wouldn’t ever need to hatch and dispose of male chicks (which, sadly, they do) to get their layer birds.

Chris said...

I haven't experienced the problems you are referring to, but I have seen in it in other set-ups I've visited.

The common issues I've found in these set-ups are lack of space, lack of grass to scratch, lack of adequate food and water and lack of sunlight.

All animals, when forced to compete for food, water and space, will cannibalize one another - even parents will eat their babies if there isn't enough food around. It's natures way of ensuring only the strongest survive in lean times.

I'm not saying your set up is deficient, but I have noticed the set-ups with high cannibalism rates, tend to overstock and under nourish. As it's winter, I'm wondering if a lack of sunlight has anything to do with your situation, simply because the daylight hours are shorter?

If humans are prone to winter blues from a lack of vitamin D, I wonder if chickens are too?

From my personal experience with rooters though, crosses have always been aggressive. The Heritage breeds I've kept, the roosters were fine growing up together and in our presence. It was the crosses which inherited the psycho gene, lol.

Also inbreeding (meaning continually breeding related birds without a new blood line) can lead to aggressive and unhealthy stock too. Often when people buy a trio to get started with, they may not ask if the male is related to the females. There could be several generations of inbreeding before the new owners start their own breeding program.

I'm not suggesting any of the above info has anything to do with your situation, but it's stuff I've come across raising chickens and thought it might be useful for reference.

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